Moved by Lord Callanan That the Grand Committee do consider the
Energy Bill Relief Scheme Regulations 2022. Relevant document: 17th
Report from the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee The
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Business,
Energy and Industrial Strategy (Lord Callanan) (Con) My Lords,
these regulations were laid before the House on 31 October. The
EBRS GB and EBRS NI schemes are necessary in response to
exceptional global...Request free trial 
                    
  Moved by 
   
   
   
  That the Grand Committee do consider the Energy Bill Relief
  Scheme Regulations 2022. 
   
  Relevant document: 17th Report from the Secondary Legislation
  Scrutiny Committee 
   
  The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for
  Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy () (Con) 
   
  My Lords, these regulations were laid before the House on 31
  October. The EBRS GB and EBRS NI schemes are necessary in
  response to exceptional global circumstances affecting energy
  prices. Putin’s illegal war in Ukraine has led to an
  unprecedented rise in energy prices, affecting businesses and
  vital services right across the UK. The Government have moved
  swiftly to introduce emergency legislation to protect consumers
  from these inflated prices, which will stop businesses
  collapsing, protect jobs and limit inflation. I am grateful to
  the opposition parties for helping us speed the legislation
  through the House. The wider negative effects of this economic
  pressure, including on the businesses of gas and electricity
  suppliers themselves, would be severe and would materialise very
  quickly in the absence of an intervention of this kind. 
   
  The Energy Bill Relief Scheme Regulations 2022 and Energy Bill
  Relief Scheme (Northern Ireland) Regulations 2022—the EBRS
  regulations—have been created under the Energy Prices Act, which,
  as the House knows, gained Royal Assent on 25 October 2022. The
  Energy Prices Act, introduced in Parliament on 12 October,
  provided the legislative footing needed to ensure that businesses
  across the UK receive support with their energy bills this winter
  through this EBRS. The regulations are essential secondary
  legislation, needed to implement and operationalise the
  ERBSs. 
   
  The regulations reduce the charges for electricity and gas
  supplied by licensed energy suppliers to eligible non-domestic
  customers and make payments to suppliers in respect of those
  reductions in Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The schemes
  represent significant and bold action by the Government to
  protect all eligible non-domestic customers—including businesses,
  charities and the public sector—such as hospitals and schools,
  from excessively high energy bills over the winter period. As a
  result, the scheme will run for a six-month period from 1 October
  2022 to 31 March 2023. 
   
  Turning to the detail of the regulations, the EBRS GB and EBRS NI
  regulations set out that, with few exceptions, all non-domestic
  customers with electricity and gas contracts from licensed
  non-domestic energy suppliers will be eligible for a discount.
  The discount will be applied to the wholesale price element of
  bills, and the regulations set out how this discount has been
  calculated. The regulations cover the process by which the energy
  supplier is reimbursed by the Secretary of State for the
  discount. Regulations give powers to the Secretary of State to
  delegate this function where he considers it appropriate. Further
  provision is included to prevent suppliers or customers deriving
  greater benefit than is intended, in order to protect the
  integrity of the schemes. 
   
  The regulations also provide for an additional reduction to be
  applied for qualifying financially disadvantaged customers who
  are supplied under so-called “deemed” or “out-of-contract”
  contracts. The EBRS NI regulations prevent end-users who are
  outside Northern Ireland receiving the discount to their bills.
  The regulations also cover essential operational matters,
  including information and reporting obligations, enforcement
  powers and powers to impose civil penalties in respect of missing
  or defective declarations. 
   
  To accompany the regulations, we have published a suite of
  legally binding rules and non-statutory guidance, which provides
  further detail on how the schemes work in practice. Given the
  urgency of ensuring that organisations receive the support they
  need this winter, we have not been able to launch a formal
  consultation. Instead, we have had extensive informal
  consultations with energy suppliers, regulatory bodies and
  delivery bodies. We commit to reviewing these instruments as
  necessary following their implementation, based on stakeholder
  feedback. Additionally, separate pass-through requirement
  regulations were laid in Parliament to ensure that intermediaries
  such as landlords, who have received energy price support, pass
  through the benefit obtained to end-users—for example,
  non-domestic customers in rented properties. This also includes
  the laying of separate regulations to ensure the pass-through of
  EBRS benefits to heat network customers. 
   
  The regulations’ objectives are to support economic growth and to
  limit inflation, and we expect their most significant impact to
  be the avoidance of the closure of many firms, and therefore of
  redundancies. The benefits of avoiding closures will accrue to
  business, while the benefits of avoiding redundancies will of
  course provide broader benefits to society. Our aim is that the
  support delivered through these schemes will enable public
  services such as schools and hospitals to continue to operate
  this winter. 
   
  The EBRSs remain a source of critical support for non-domestic
  customers across the United Kingdom. Let me emphasise that the
  measures in these regulations are crucial for the effective
  operation of the schemes. The schemes will complement the other
  large-scale support the Government are providing with energy and
  the cost of living. I hope the House will be able to support
  these measures and their objectives. I commend the draft
  regulations to the House. 
   
   (Con) 
   
  My Lords, I take this opportunity to congratulate the Government
  and my noble friend the Minister on bringing through the enabling
  Act and in particular the regulations before us this afternoon. I
  commend the support the Government are giving both to
  non-domestic and domestic customers. If my noble friend will
  permit, I have a number of questions I would like to press him
  on, but that does not detract from my overall support for the
  scheme. 
   
  The Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee prepared a very
  helpful brief, which states that the instruments are made to
  delegate powers to enable the Secretary of State to make
  technical rules for the effective operation of the EBRS,
  including rules for the calculation and recovery of accounts.
  Paragraph 7.1 of the helpful Explanatory Memorandum appended to
  the regulations states that the Secretary of State 
   
  “can reimburse licensed non-domestic energy suppliers applying
  price reductions on customers’ bills representing the wholesale
  energy price element of the bill. This will allow non-domestic
  customers to receive the benefit of such a discount.” 
   
  I welcome what my noble friend said about landlords passing this
  on to those who operate the businesses; that will be very welcome
  indeed. 
   
  Paragraph 7.2 of the Explanatory Memorandum say that the
  Secretary of State is required, 
   
  “within 14 days of the schemes’ introduction date, to make rules
  about further reductions”. 
   
  The rules will apply to the supply of gas and electricity for the
  period referred to by my noble friend. Will there be an
  opportunity for the Committee or the House to see them in advance
  and to scrutinise them? Will they be laid before the House? I
  realise they are technical rules, but it would be helpful for us
  to see them. 
   
  Paragraph 11.1 refers to stakeholders, individual organisations
  and so forth. I would like to make plea for the plight of
  publicans in pubs, restaurants, bars and cafés, who will benefit
  from this scheme until the end of March. It is particularly
  welcome in the run-up to Christmas, and in January and February,
  which tend to be slow months, as it recognises their need to
  incur high energy and electricity costs to make a welcoming
  atmosphere. My noble friend is probably not in a position to tell
  us today—we will have to wait until tomorrow or even the March
  Budget—what will happen after this scheme expires. I do not want
  to be like Oliver Twist and ask for more, but it would be helpful
  for businesses to know what the future will be. My noble friend
  has rightly identified that the regulations and the enabling
  legislation under which they fall are intended to prevent
  closures and job losses resulting from high wholesale energy
  costs, which we know are largely global in nature. 
   
  I also make a plea for non-domestic customers and businesses that
  operate in rural areas. The Minister and I are from the
  north-east of England. I grew up there and represented part of
  North Yorkshire for 18 years in the other place. In about a
  week’s time, we will have the first anniversary of Storm Arwen,
  when a number of businesses closed. Those who were not fortunate
  enough to have generators were heavily penalised. As part of
  learning from that, I met our local director of the NFU, which is
  keen to work with the Government and other bodies to see how we
  can enhance infrastructure and the grid in rural areas where we
  are heavily dependent on off-grid fuels such as oil, solid fuel
  and LPG, and to look at what prospect there might be for
  developing those off-grid resources. It is basically about
  lessons learned from Storm Arwen, in what was a very difficult
  time. 
   
  These regulations were debated in the other place by the
  Delegated Legislation Committee on Monday 14 November. It was
  asked then why there had not been a greater assessment of the
  impact of administration and resource costs on Ofgem, which will
  be heavily involved in monitoring compliance. Has BEIS looked at
  that? Will it have time to do so in the next few weeks? Secondly,
  if a company has outstanding debt on bills of greater than 28
  days, it effectively does not qualify. For what reason has that
  benchmark been chosen? With those few questions, I wish Godspeed
  to the regulations and congratulate my noble friend and his
  department on the work they have done in this regard, for both
  non-domestic and domestic customers. 
   
  I have one further question, which relates more to domestic
  customers. What I would identify as sharp practices are being
  developed by electricity providers on the back of the
  Government’s generosity in this regard. When a customer is in
  credit, their direct debit payments are going up, which I can see
  no rhyme or reason for. If a customer is in credit, why on earth
  would you seek to increase their direct debit, particularly when
  the Government have lent the generous help that they have?
  Another such practice happens when, no matter how many meter
  readings they may give, the customer ends up with an estimated
  bill. Again, that seems to be a way of bumping up the price. I
  would welcome any response that my noble friend has to what seem
  to be developing sharp practices. 
   
   (LD) 
   
  My Lords, we on our side very much welcome this relief for
  businesses and commercial operations with regard to energy
  prices. Again, I very much echo the noble Baroness, Lady
  McIntosh, on the fact that the evaluation does not take place
  until three months. I understand the issue of how you would
  evaluate it before that, but there is no obligation to put
  forward further plans until the end of the scheme, after six
  months. I would be interested to hear an answer on that. 
   
  4.30pm 
   
  I have just two questions for the Minister—and I will keep it
  just to two, so I get an answer today. The first is on the issue
  of second homes sometimes masquerading as holiday lets which are
  often used by the owners as well. I want to understand where they
  are in this. In a lot of seaside areas where local residents are
  not necessarily particularly well off, there would be a concern
  if homeowners who have had their properties registered as
  businesses for business rates received these payments. That is
  quite an issue, and I would be interested to understand how the
  Government will look at that. 
   
  My second question is on the issue of fraud. I cannot remember
  where it was in the Explanatory Memorandum, but I welcome the
  fact that that is discussed in these papers. It must be
  relatively easy to police this scheme to make sure that retail
  energy companies pass on the money to consumers. I do not see
  that as a big issue; it is relatively easy. However, the other
  area that was brought up is where landlords effectively pass on
  an electricity cost separately to their tenants. As the Minister
  will know, often for small businesses the balance of power
  between landlord and tenant is very much in favour of the
  landlord, and often tenants do not want to have arguments with
  their landlords. The paper suggests that the department will keep
  a close eye on that. I do not understand how that can happen. I
  am not saying that that will be an easy area of policing, but I
  would be keen to hear the Minister’s opinion on how that would be
  policed and enforced, given that asymmetric power that often is
  in that relationship. However, I welcome the secondary
  legislation. 
   
   (Lab) 
   
  My Lords, first, I thank the Minister for bringing forward the
  instruments today and thank the stalwarts of the energy debates,
  the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh, and the noble Lord, , for their questions and
  comments, which I am sure will be responded to. 
   
  These are the first two instruments from the Energy Prices Act,
  which we debated recently. We supported the Bill during its
  passage and appreciate the pressing need to have these
  arrangements in law as soon as possible. As such, we will not be
  preventing the passage of these instruments. This also means that
  many of the points that we have made in regard to these
  instruments have already been debated in passing the Energy
  Prices Act. I will not spend time dealing with that and repeating
  points but rather will focus on the specific contents of the
  instruments before us today, not least as we will be considering
  more before too long. 
   
  As we have heard, between them these two instruments make
  provision for the implementation of the energy bill relief
  scheme—the EBRS—for non-domestic customers across the UK, with
  powers derived from the Energy Prices Act: Section 9 for Great
  Britain and Section 11 for Northern Ireland. To comment on a
  point that the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh, raised, what these
  instruments do not do is to set out the exact terms of the
  scheme, neither for the first six months, which is now clear, nor
  for the following 18-month period that the Act allows these
  powers to provide for. We now know the Government’s plans for the
  first six months—they were recently revealed—but we have heard
  little on their plans for the period thereafter. Like the noble
  Baroness, Lady McIntosh, if the Minister is able to, I would
  appreciate it if he could elaborate on what is proposed, or at
  least update us on the progress of their consideration as to what
  might happen for the latter part of the period that this Act
  governs. 
   
  Part 3 of the instrument relates to discount recovery, on which I
  have a small item to raise. I understand that Energy UK
  previously expressed concerns to the Minister about the
  arrangements in this part. Its interpretation is that energy
  suppliers would not receive financial cover to cover the
  difference between normal and capped unit rates, which is
  inconsistent with what the Energy Prices Act suggested. That
  issue appears to have been fixed, which is welcome, but it is
  troublesome that it was not the case from the outset. I am keen
  to hear an explanation from the Minister of how these issues
  emerged and some reassurance that, in action, energy companies
  will have no difficulty receiving their entitlements. 
   
  I also understand that the consultation to resolve the issue took
  place under non-disclosure agreements, which not only is
  concerning in itself but, as Energy UK raised, often means that
  not all suppliers are included in talks and that the industry
  cannot work together with the Government to come to the best
  solutions. This seems neither a sustainable nor an effective way
  of creating policy. 
   
  Part 5 of the instrument, which relates to qualifying financially
  disadvantaged customers, requires the Secretary of State to make
  rules about further reductions that the suppliers must apply to
  the amounts payable of these customers within 14 days of the
  scheme’s introduction date. As the Explanatory Memorandum
  says, 
   
  “The current levels of many deemed and out-of-contract tariffs
  mean that, even with the discounts provided by the rest of the
  EBRS scheme, these customers … would often still experience
  particular difficulty in obtaining a supply of energy at a
  reasonable rate”. 
   
  It is welcome that additional support will be set out. However,
  given the situation, waiting until 14 days after the scheme’s
  introduction does little to offer reassurance to these customers
  and makes it difficult, if not impossible, for your Lordships to
  scrutinise the plans. Perhaps the Minister could give some
  advance notice of the Government’s plans for this section. 
   
  Before I finish, I briefly revisit one broader area from the
  Energy Prices Act, regarding the powers of the Secretary of
  State, some of which allow them to escape secondary legislation.
  Of course, that is not the case here, as we are debating
  secondary legislation, but I use this opportunity to repeat our
  regret that other significant powers given by the Act are not
  subject to parliamentary debates such as this. 
   
   (Non-Afl) 
   
  My Lords, could I intervene before the Minister responds? I have
  carefully gone through the Energy Bill Relief Scheme Regulations
  2022 and the Energy Bill Relief Scheme (Northern Ireland)
  Regulations 2022, which are about the same thickness, to see
  where the differences are. Obviously, we know that the situation
  is different in Northern Ireland, so there have to be some
  differences, but it would be helpful if, in winding, the Minister
  could clarify any substantial differences between how the scheme
  is going to work in Northern Ireland and in the rest of the
  United Kingdom. As the Minister is aware, we in Northern Ireland
  are always wary of being treated slightly differently for some
  unknown reason that we find out about later. I appreciate that
  there have to be separate regulations on this, but I would
  appreciate clarification on any substantial differences. 
   
   (Con) 
   
  I first thank noble Lords for their contributions to this debate.
  As I said, the Government have implemented the EBRS GB and NI
  schemes to ensure that non-domestic consumers are protected from
  excessively high energy bills over the winter period. The schemes
  will make sure that the amount that eligible businesses pay for
  their wholesale energy costs comes down to a reasonable level,
  with some saving over 50% on those costs. 
   
  I am sure it is reassuring for the House to know that the schemes
  are already in force and delivering support to organisations
  across the UK. I hope this reassures the public that the
  Government are committed to taking decisive action to alleviate
  at least part of this energy crisis. 
   
  As well as providing immediate relief, these schemes will support
  economic growth and have the happy effect of limiting inflation
  caused by increasing energy bills and the knock-on effects on
  prices, labour, goods and services. As I said at the start, we
  are confident that the schemes will seek to avoid firm closures
  and redundancies and will ensure that vital public services and
  charities can continue to operate over the winter. 
   
  We will continue to monitor the schemes to ensure that this
  support is provided to the people and businesses that they are
  designed to help. We are committed to reviewing the schemes by
  the end of the year and will continue to work with stakeholders
  to ensure that their feedback is taken into account. We will use
  the review to look at how best to offer further support to
  customers who are most at risk from energy price increases beyond
  April 2023. 
   
  I start off with the contribution of my noble friend Lady
  McIntosh, who asked whether the House would have the opportunity
  to review the rules accompanying the statutory instrument. It is
  worth pointing out that the schemes have been set up at pace, and
  the House of course helped by passing the legislation at pace, to
  deal with the crisis. Therefore, it is right that the more
  technical details of the scheme have been included in statutory
  rules, which have been published on GOV.UK. The first tranche of
  EBRS GB and NI rules were published on 1 November; amendment
  rules relating to discount recovery were published on 4 November;
  and a third tranche of amendment rules relating to disputes and
  treatment of financially disadvantaged customers was published on
  9 November. Minor changes made via amending rules were published
  on 10 November. If the noble Baroness wants to check on GOV.UK,
  she can while away her weekend reading the rules in detail. The
  business support scheme is intended to give immediate relief to
  businesses and other non-domestic consumers from the current
  level of inflated electricity and gas prices. 
   
  The noble Lord, , and my noble friend Lady
  McIntosh asked the good question about what will happen in six
  months’ time, once these schemes come to an end. I cannot say
  that I have an answer for the Committee at the moment, because we
  are still to conduct the review of the scheme, which we have said
  that we will do by the end of the year. Perhaps if I set out what
  the review will consider, that will give the Committee some clues
  as to where we intend to go with this. The review will consider
  how best to offer further support to customers who are most at
  risk of energy price increases. By their very nature, they are
  likely to be those who are least able to adjust—for example, by
  reducing their energy uses or increasing their energy efficiency.
  Of course, any further support will begin at the end of the
  initial six-month support scheme. 
   
  My noble friend Lady McIntosh asked something that, I have to
  say, has nothing to do with these regulations, about lessons
  learned from Storm Arwen. We have had extensive discussions on
  that subject in this House. We published a comprehensive review
  of the recommendations for improvement of the electricity sector
  in response to Storm Arwen. There were a number of key
  recommendations covering enhancing system resilience; protecting
  customers; and additional support, such as compensation. The
  recommendations are due to be finalised by December 2023, but the
  majority are already complete, ahead of this winter. 
   
  My noble friend also asked about the assessment of the impact of
  administration and resource costs to Ofgem. Of course, we are
  working very closely with Ofgem to ensure the effective
  enforcement of the scheme requirements, and we will ensure that
  it has the necessary resources to carry out its role in this and
  many other government schemes operating in the energy sector.
  Given the pace at which we had to deliver the impact assessments
  of this time-bound intervention, we have focused on the largest
  and most significant impact—of course, the direct costs to the
  Exchequer. 
   
  My noble friend also asked about the 28-day disqualification
  policy. The arrears rule already referred to applies only to the
  additional discounts that suppliers are required to apply to
  those qualifying disadvantaged on deemed or out-of-contract
  contracts. That is in addition to the main EBRS discount. 
   
  On the points made about suppliers increasing energy bills, the
  EBRS scheme is shielding businesses across the country from
  soaring energy prices. The vast majority of energy suppliers are
  operating responsibly and within the spirit of the scheme. Of
  course, we are aware of reports that some companies are being
  faced with excessively high quotes this winter. I can tell the
  House that we will take a robust approach to this, and we are
  working with Ofgem to ensure that the licensing conditions have
  not been breached and that businesses are able to see the full
  effects of support offered by the scheme. 
   
  My noble friend Lady McIntosh also raised the issue of the UK’s
  energy resilience in winter. We have a secure and diverse energy
  system, and we are confident of our plans to protect households
  and businesses in the full range of scenarios this winter, in
  light of Russia’s illegal war. 
   
  4.45pm 
   
  My noble friend will be aware that to strengthen this position
  further we have put plans in place to secure supply, and the
  national grid, working alongside energy suppliers and Ofgem, will
  launch a voluntary service to reward users who are able to reduce
  their demand at peak times. Happily, unlike many other parts of
  Europe, Britain is not dependent on Russian energy imports, and
  we are at a strategic advantage through access to our own North
  Sea gas reserves and steady imports from reliable partners, such
  as Norway, the second largest LNG infrastructure in Europe in
  Europe, and a gas supply underpinned by robust legal
  contracts—and, of course, the enormous investment that we are
  making in clean energy sources. So, although we are not
  complacent, we are in fact in a much better position than many
  other countries in Europe. 
   
  The noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh, raised a point about consumers
  who are in credit—she was talking about consumers, whereas this
  scheme concentrates on non-domestic customers. I will answer the
  question now, but it is more appropriate for the next debate
  about direct debit payments. Ofgem have looked into this and
  found no evidence that direct debits are being widely inflated,
  but it identified some weaknesses in some suppliers’ processes
  that could result in suppliers setting some direct debits
  incorrectly. It is very important at this time that consumers can
  trust that their direct debit is an accurate reflection of their
  consumption and are given enough information to understand why
  they are paying the amount they are. It is worth pointing out
  that you can contact your supplier to ask for your direct debit
  to be reduced. I know that because I have done it myself. My
  account was in credit and, therefore, I was able to say, “You
  have put my direct debit up too much. I do not need to be paying
  this much” and the supplier happily reduced it, so it is possible
  to do that. 
   
  The noble Lords,  and , both asked about the
  enforcement of the pass-through requirements, which were in SIs
  tabled separately. The legislation makes it clear that
  intermediaries must pass the benefit through to end users and
  must also ensure that the end user is equipped with the
  information to understand what benefit they are entitled to and
  be able to dispute this and/or how it has been applied. We have
  introduced regulations to allow end users to pursue recovery of
  benefits as a debt through civil proceedings. End users can
  recover claims to pass through amounts as civil debts in the
  county court, in the same way that other outstanding amounts owed
  to an individual can be claimed. 
   
  We have also introduced guidance on the pass-through requirements
  for energy price support, including a link to how to make a court
  claim for money. Although I understand the point the noble Lord,
  , made about the relative
  imbalance of power in some of these relationships, we are doing
  all we can to make sure that people are able to exercise the
  rights that this legislation has given them. The enforcement
  system is the same across all the schemes, with a slight nuance
  for heat networks under the EBRS. The legislation requires heat
  networks also to pass on the benefits of the EBRS to their end
  consumers in the form of lower heating bills, and if heat network
  customers do not receive the pass-through or information from
  their heat supplier, they will be able to raise a complaint with
  the energy ombudsman. 
   
  In response to the noble Lord, , who asked how we are ensuring
  that companies receive these vital discounts, again, we are
  working closely with energy suppliers on the development of the
  scheme. Energy suppliers have already submitted their first
  payment requests to the department and they will be paid shortly.
  Discounts will start to appear in customers’ bills from this
  month, backdated to cover their consumption from 1 October. 
   
  As I mentioned earlier, rules regarding Part 5 of the regulations
  have now been published. The additional reductions introduced
  through this new rule will be applied by energy suppliers in line
  with the savings they are making thanks to EBRS reducing the
  overall risk that customers cannot pay their bills on time. A
  further reduction may also apply if the amount charged is
  considered unduly onerous under section 7.4 of the relevant
  standard licensing conditions, which is enforceable by Ofgem. 
   
  In response to the noble Baroness, Lady Hoey, who asked about the
  substantial differences between the Northern Ireland and Great
  Britain schemes, they are essentially similar, but the Northern
  Ireland scheme’s delivery approach diverges slightly from GB’s in
  that it requires suppliers in Northern Ireland to abide by
  obligations in the regulations enforced by the Northern Ireland
  utility regulator, UREGNI—I am sure the noble Baroness is more
  familiar with that than I am. The regulations reflect this and
  the role of the Northern Ireland utility regulator in enforcing
  the schemes. There are a number of other technical differences,
  including an additional contract type, the day ahead index price
  contract, and there is an extra discount recovery process in
  Chapter 4 to prevent a Northern Irish recipient of supply
  eligible for the EBRS NI from then passing on that reduction to
  an end user in the Republic—which I am sure is something the
  noble Baroness would strongly support. 
   
  
  (DUP) 
   
  I listened to what the Minister said and return to a point raised
  by the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh. Do I take from the
  Minister’s remarks that there is going to be a review after the
  winter period that is covered by the present legislation? There
  are many small businesses scattered across the community in
  Northern Ireland that are totally dependent on electricity and
  have therefore met this volatility in energy prices. It is hard
  for them to plan for the future without knowledge of where we
  will go after the short period covered here. How long does the
  Minister think the review will take, because these businesses
  certainly need to plan for the future? 
   
   (Con) 
   
  The noble Lord makes a very good point. As I said, we will
  conduct a review as soon as possible with the aim that it will be
  published before the end of the year. That will inform businesses
  of where we hope to go with the scheme after its expiry in April.
  That applies not just to businesses in Northern Ireland but to
  small businesses across the whole United Kingdom. 
   
  In conclusion, the Government remain committed to ensuring that
  consumers receive help with the rising cost of living and with
  energy costs. These regulations are vital to ensuring that
  support is delivered this coming winter. I commend this draft
  instrument to the Committee. 
   
   (LD) 
   
  I thank the Minister for his reply to my point on fraud but, as
  he has not replied on holiday home lets, I assume that, if they
  are on business rates, they will get this benefit. 
   
   (Con) 
   
  There are two aspects to this support. The price guarantee
  applies to domestic consumers and the EBRS applies to business
  consumers. If it is registered as a domestic premise, the home
  owner would receive this support in the same way as other owners
  of multiple homes would receive it—under the domestic scheme. If
  it is registered as a business, again they would receive a price
  discount. That applies to all businesses across the UK, with a
  few exceptions for some generators. 
   
  I take the noble Lord’s point about how this will probably go
  down badly in the areas concerned, but the scheme was rolled out
  at pace. We saw similar effects with the Bounce Back Loan Scheme
  during the pandemic. By the very nature of these schemes, if you
  do not spend years putting the scheme in place, going through
  every detail and exempting certain groups that might perhaps be
  undeserving of the support, there will be cases that most people
  regard as slightly unfair. That is in the nature of rolling
  something out quickly. We needed to get the support out quickly,
  which is why this has been done that way. 
   
  Motion agreed.
  
                                    
             
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