The Chair
My selection and grouping for today’s meeting is available online
and in the room. No amendments were tabled. We will have a single
debate covering the six clauses of the Bill. The formal decisions
on those clauses will be taken without further debate at the
end.
Clause 1
Duties of Drivers
The Chair
With this it will be convenient to discuss clauses 2 to 6 stand
part.
(Kenilworth and Southam)
(Con)
It is a great pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs
Murray, and I thank all members of the Committee for their
attendance and assistance in scrutinising this Bill today. I hope
it will be helpful if I explain what the Bill seeks to achieve,
and what its clauses will do.
The Bill aims to amend the Equality Act 2010 to do four main
things. First, it creates new duties for taxi and private hire
vehicle drivers and private hire vehicle operators to ensure that
a disabled person is provided with reasonable assistance, and is
not unfairly charged or refused a booking simply because they are
disabled. Secondly, it affords disabled passengers assistance in
identifying a vehicle where appropriate. Thirdly, it requires
local licensing authorities to maintain and publish a list of
wheelchair-accessible taxi and private hire vehicles, ensuring
that both the new and existing duties are consistently applied.
Fourthly, it amends the taxi and private hire vehicle driver
exemptions for those with a disability or physical impairment, to
ensure they are exempt only from the duties it would be
unreasonable for them to fulfil.
Clause 1 would create two new sets of duties in sections 164A and
165A of the Equality Act, and amend the existing duties in
section 165 of that Act. Section 164A would create new duties on
drivers of non-wheelchair-accessible taxis and private hire
vehicles not to refuse carriage to any disabled person who could
reasonably travel in their vehicle; to make every reasonable
effort to ensure the disabled passenger is comfortable and safe
while travelling; and not to charge them any extra for doing
so.
The amendments to section 165 would complement section 164A by
ensuring that those duties are consistently applied to drivers of
designated wheelchair-accessible taxi and private hire vehicles.
Section 165A would create new duties on drivers of private hire
vehicles and pre-booked taxis to assist any disabled person to
identify the vehicle at no extra charge. This would support not
only visually impaired passengers, but those with less evident
impairments, such as cognitive, memory and learning
impairments.
For too long, the Equality Act’s patchwork of rights and
protections, based on specific impairments, vehicles and ways of
travelling, have excluded many disabled people from basic rights
and protections when travelling in a taxi or private hire
vehicle. These new and amended duties cover not only any disabled
person who can reasonably access a taxi or private hire vehicle,
whether it be wheelchair accessible or not, but the range of
scenarios in which a disabled person intends to travel. If a
wheelchair user intends to transfer to a passenger seat, it
cannot be right that they would have rights and protections if
they were accessing a designated wheelchair-accessible taxi or
private hire vehicle, but would have no rights or protections in
a non-designated wheelchair-accessible vehicle. This Bill will
put that right.
Clause 4 proposes to add a new offence for private hire vehicle
operators who fail or refuse to accept a booking from any
disabled person because of their disability, or charge extra for
duties that their drivers must fulfil—a right and protection
currently offered only to assistance dog owners, which should
apply to all disabled people. Clause 5 proposes amendments to
sections 168 and 170 of the Equality Act to ensure that the
duties not to make, or propose to make, any additional charge for
carrying an assistance dog are consistent with the same duties
applied in relation to disabled people and wheelchair users in
sections 164A and 165A. That clause would also make other minor
and consequential amendments in relation to certain definitions
and cross-referencing for the numbering of sections.
Collectively, the new and revised duties in clauses 1, 4 and 5
will resolve the inconsistencies in the Equality Act 2010. No
matter their impairment or the type of vehicle they wish to
travel in, disabled people should not be unfairly treated when
accessing a taxi or private hire vehicle. These clauses will
provide any disabled person with protections from, and rights not
to be subject to, unfair treatment, providing reassurance that
they will receive reasonable assistance to travel where they want
to go.
(Bexleyheath and Crayford)
(Con)
I have listened with great interest to my right hon. and learned
Friend. This is a most welcome Bill. Many taxis in London already
do the things he highlights—I am a big supporter of London taxis,
because they do a fantastic job and offer a good service—but the
new duties are needed to ensure that those with disabilities are
treated as fairly and equally as everybody else. I welcome the
Bill, and I put on the record that London taxis are great.
I agree with my right hon. Friend: London taxis are great. He
will be reassured to learn that I spoke to representatives of
London taxi drivers about the Bill. He is entirely right: there
are many very good drivers of taxis and private hire vehicles who
do all the things the Bill is intended to achieve. But as he will
recognise, and as I will repeat in a moment, it is important to
raise the standards for all drivers. However, he is entirely
right to recognise the good work of London taxi drivers and,
indeed, taxi drivers elsewhere in the country.
It is important to note that, to make the Bill work in practice
and ensure that taxi and private hire vehicle drivers and
operators are not unfairly penalised, defences are in place for
cases where a driver could not reasonably have known that a
passenger was disabled or required mobility assistance, or where
a driver could not reasonably or safely have carried the
passenger and their wheelchair or mobility aids. However, in
order for the existing duties in section 165 of the Equality Act
to work for any wheelchair user intending to travel in a
wheelchair-accessible taxi or private hire vehicle, they must be
applied consistently across the country.
Clause 3 would amend the existing duties on local licensing
authorities in section 167 of the Equality Act, requiring them to
maintain and publish their list of designated
wheelchair-accessible taxi and private hire vehicles. That
matters because it is only by being designated a
wheelchair-accessible taxi or private hire vehicle that the
duties on drivers set out in section 165 apply. The clause would
end the current state of affairs where these duties apply only
based on a local licensing authority’s decision to maintain a
designated list or not. It would also go further than that,
requiring local licensing authorities to publish their lists,
providing easily accessible information about locally accessible
services to wheelchair users who rely on those
wheelchair-accessible vehicles.
Currently, section 166 of the Equality Act allows a driver of a
designated wheelchair-accessible taxi or private hire vehicle to
apply for an exemption on medical grounds or owing to a physical
condition. A driver with an exemption is, by default, exempt from
all the duties in section 165, including the duty not to charge
disabled passengers extra, which are not affected by an exempt
driver’s medical or physical condition. Clause 2 would amend
section 166 so that exemptions apply only to duties to give the
passenger such mobility assistance as is reasonably required
under new section 164A and section 165 of the 2010 Act. Other
duties, such as to carry the passenger and not to impose
additional charges, would still apply to drivers who hold medical
exemption certificates.
Finally, clause 6 covers the extent and commencement of the Bill.
First, it provides that the Bill applies to England and Wales and
to Scotland. Secondly, it will commence at the end of the period
of two months beginning with the day on which it is passed. This
will ensure the swift implementation of the rights and
protections that the Bill offers disabled people while providing
local licensing authorities and drivers sufficient time to review
and prepare for the changes. On that point, I stress, as I said a
moment ago, that the Bill will not impact the excellent service
that the vast majority of drivers already provide to disabled
people, as they already fulfil the fundamental duties that the
Bill proposes.
During the covid-19 pandemic, for example, drivers provided a
vital service, transporting essential workers to their places of
work and ensuring that those who needed it most arrived safely at
their medical appointments. However, we must ensure that all
drivers meet the reasonable duties in the Bill so that any
disabled person has rights and protections to access a taxi or
private hire vehicle across the country.
I hope that that explanation of the Bill has been helpful to the
Committee and that the reasons I have set out make it clear that
the law simply cannot continue to provide rights and protections
for some disabled people when accessing taxis or private hire
vehicles, but not others.
(Sheffield, Brightside and
Hillsborough) (Lab)
It is a pleasure to serve under your chairpersonship, Mrs Murray.
I start by congratulating the right hon. and learned Member for
Kenilworth and Southam on bringing the Bill forward and
overcoming all the hurdles that private Members’ Bills face to
get to this stage.
Disabled people across the country still face unacceptable
barriers when going about their everyday lives, not least when
travelling. Research shows that 60% of disabled people do not
have a car, and public transport is still nowhere near accessible
enough. Hence, for many disabled people, taxis are the only
option if they are to continue to live an independent life. As
the explanatory notes highlight, disabled people take on average
twice the number of taxi journeys each year as those without
disabilities. The Bill therefore presents a perfect opportunity
to tackle discrimination against all disabled people when they
use taxis and private hire vehicles. Its aims are commendable and
have the full support of the Opposition.
I am proud of the last Labour Government’s landmark Equality Act
2010, which provides comprehensive protections against
discrimination that is due to someone’s disability. It is in that
spirit that I share the assessment in this Bill that specific
rights already given to wheelchair users and those with guide
dogs should be extended to all disabled people. The new
obligations under clause 1 are eminently reasonable and have the
potential to vastly improve the lives of people with
disabilities.
I also welcome the provisions under clause 3, which require local
authorities to maintain a list of wheelchair-accessible vehicles.
Although the majority of local authorities do that already, we
support making it mandatory. That will ensure that wheelchair
users can quickly and conveniently book a taxi, safe in the
knowledge that it will be accessible to them.
However, after a decade of austerity I am concerned about the
capacity that local authorities have to create and maintain their
lists. For instance, in my patch, Sheffield City Council has seen
its spending power cut by £215 million since 2010—almost a half
of its total budget. I note that in the explanatory notes the
Department for Transport commits to publishing guidance for local
authorities. I would welcome further details from the Minister
about that and a commitment to providing administrative support
to local authorities whose budgets are already stretched wafer
thin. We must ensure that the lists are up to date and easily
accessible across the entire country or the provision simply will
not work.
I move on to the issue of enforcement. Although current
legislation makes it an offence to refuse to carry a passenger on
the basis that they have a guide dog with them, all too often we
hear stories of people still being turned away for that reason.
Given these new duties, we must ensure that people with
disabilities are fully aware of their rights and know exactly who
to turn to if they are ever denied them. It is also vital that
taxi drivers have the adequate guidelines and training to match
their new responsibilities. We must ensure that they have the
confidence to assist people of all disabilities before, during
and after their journeys. Guidance and training must cover how to
provide safe and comfortable travel to people with all
disabilities and make drivers aware of the specific adjustments
that they may have to make.
It is our hope that the two-month period between the Bill’s being
passed and its coming into force will be used by the Government
to ensure that all taxi drivers are fully aware of their new
obligations. The Bill will, of course, rightly penalise those who
fail to live up to their responsibilities. However, it is our
sincere hope that the primary outcome of this legislation will be
a cultural change whereby people can safely and confidently use
taxis without fear of being discriminated against due to their
disability.
(Clwyd South) (Con)
I consider the hon. Lady’s remarks to be very constructive and I
strongly agree with them. I am sure she will join me in balancing
the requirements of this private Member’s Bill, which are very
necessary, against a recognition of the fantastic service that
many taxi drivers and private hire vehicles have provided,
particularly during the covid crisis. They have been a lifeline
for many disabled and vulnerable people.
I completely agree. I represent an area where a large number of
taxi drivers live. At one point, my son-in-law was a taxi driver;
I praise him every day for his past service. He spent a lot of
time taking renal patients to hospital in the early mornings. The
job is about not just picking up people from the roadside but
getting people to dialysis and children with special needs to
school. It is something of a public service.
I invite the Minister to outline how she intends to work with
local authorities to ensure that the message is effectively
communicated to all taxi and private hire vehicle drivers.
I conclude by once again commending the right hon. and learned
Member for Kenilworth and Southam for progressing the Bill and
the Minister for giving it the Government’s support. The Bill
will not put an end to the discrimination that disabled people
continue to face every day, but it is a big step in the right
direction. I look forward to working in the spirit of cross-party
co-operation to ensure that it delivers on its aims.
The Minister of State, Department for Transport ()
It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs Murray, in
this Committee to consider the private Member’s Bill of my right
hon. and learned Friend the Member for Kenilworth and Southam. I
put on the record my thanks to him for his dedication and hard
work in bringing the Bill forward.
First, and most importantly, I would like to reiterate a point
raised on Second Reading: the vast majority of taxi and private
hire vehicle drivers provide a professional and first class
service, as we have heard from hon. Members on both sides this
morning. They strive to support all passengers, both disabled and
non-disabled, including during the worst of the covid-19
pandemic. The Bill is not intended to unfairly penalise or put
unreasonable burdens on these drivers—indeed, it will make things
fairer for them. It is not right that some drivers have legal
duties under the Equality Act 2010 while others do not. The
Government remain committed to ensuring that disabled people have
the same access to transport as everyone else, which is why I am
pleased to confirm that the Bill has the full support of the
Government.
At present, only wheelchair users and assistance dog users have
the rights and protections under the 2010 Act concerning the use
of taxis and private hire vehicles. Even those rights and
protections do not apply consistently. Clauses 1 and 4 would
rectify that by creating new duties to ensure that any disabled
person who could reasonably travel in a taxi or private hire
vehicle is protected against refusals and extra costs, and
afforded reasonable assistance to make their journey in comfort
and safety, regardless of their disability and whether the
vehicle is wheelchair-accessible or not, provided that their
wheelchair or mobility aids can be carried safely and reasonably
in the vehicle.
I am pleased to say that the Bill would go further than
rectifying that inconsistency. In addition, it would afford
disabled passengers assistance in identifying the vehicle where
appropriate. Crucially, it would also strengthen existing duties.
Clauses 1, 3 and 5 would tighten the wording in the 2010 Act to
ensure that the duties are appropriately defined. In particular,
clause 3 would remove the postcode lottery for the duties applied
to wheelchair-accessible taxis and private hire vehicles by
requiring all local licensing authorities to maintain and publish
a list of wheelchair-accessible taxis and private hire vehicles.
That is currently not a requirement.
Although I am pleased that 70% of authorities in England have
none the less chosen to provide such a list, 30% still do not.
The Bill will address that, ensuring that drivers of vehicles on
such lists will be subject to the relevant duties. I am satisfied
that defences are in place for cases in which a driver could not
reasonably have known that a passenger was disabled or required
mobility assistance, or could not reasonably or safely have
carried the passenger and their wheelchair or mobility aids.
9.45am
When considering duties for disabled passengers, it is also
important to consider disabled taxi and private hire vehicle
drivers, too. For some drivers, providing mobility assistance
simply is not feasible because they have a medical condition or
impairment themselves. The last thing that the Bill intends is to
deter those drivers from operating. Instead, it would balance the
needs of such drivers with the needs of disabled passengers.
Clause 2 would address that by allowing drivers to have medical
exemptions from the provision of mobility assistance—on medical
grounds or because of their physical condition, as
appropriate.
I am pleased to say, however, that the measure would remove any
exemptions from the broader duties to carry disabled passengers,
including to charge extra for any assistance the driver does
provide. As my right hon. and learned Friend the Member for
Kenilworth and Southam has already made clear, that will have no
impact on a driver who is exempt from carrying out those duties
on medical grounds or because of their physical condition.
Clause 6 provides for commencement just two months after the Bill
is passed, which the Government wholeheartedly support to deliver
benefits to disabled passengers quickly. We also believe that
commencement is reasonable in its impact on taxi and private hire
vehicle drivers and operators.
The Government estimate that the cost to taxi and private hire
vehicle drivers of familiarising themselves with the proposed
changes will be, at most, one hour per driver. For the many
drivers who are already fulfilling the duties that the Bill
proposes, the additional duties will have minimal impact—for
example, where this is not already happening, a driver who takes
a booking from a person who states that they are visually
impaired might volunteer additional information to help the
passenger identify and find the vehicle, and/or request
information to help them identify the passenger.
As I have already mentioned, 30% of local licensing authorities
do not maintain a list of designated wheelchair accessible taxis
and private hire vehicles.
(Hastings and Rye)
(Con)
It is worth noting that clause 3 standardises the lists across
all local authorities. That is very welcome because, as Members
will know, rules are not currently standardised across all local
licensing authorities.
My hon. Friend makes an important point. It is important to
ensure that disabled people and people who require help or a
wheelchair have confidence that this information is available and
consistent. Let us face it: people do often move around from one
local authority to another, so consistency is important.
Our expectation is that all local licensing authorities already
have data available on wheelchair-accessible vehicles, as they
already provide this data to the Department for Transport
annually. The hon. Member for Sheffield, Brightside and
Hillsborough asked about the cost to local licensing authorities
of publishing such a list, and we expect that cost to be low. To
support local licensing authorities to implement the new duties,
the Government will update our current statutory guidance in
advance of the Bill’s commencement. I hope that offers the hon.
Lady the reassurance that she is looking for.
The Bill would greatly support the Government’s aim of improving
the accessibility of the transport network by increasing
assistance and protection against discrimination for disabled
taxi and private hire vehicle passengers. I reiterate my thanks
to my right hon. and learned Friend for his hard work and for the
collaborative way in which we have got to this point. I look
forward to following the Bill through its remaining parliamentary
stages.
With your leave, may I begin by thanking you, Mrs Murray, for
shepherding us so efficiently through this process? I also offer
my thanks to your Clerk, who has given me some very sage advice
throughout the Bill’s passage. I hope that he will not stop now
and continue to offer that advice as we move forward to the
remaining stages.
I thank very much the hon. Member for Sheffield, Brightside and
Hillsborough, who speaks for the official Opposition, for her
support for the Bill, and I thank my hon. Friend the Minister for
everything that she said. May I take this opportunity to
congratulate my hon. Friend on her well-deserved promotion in the
Department? I hope that she will continue to take an active
interest in the Bill as it proceeds.
Finally, I thank every member of the Committee for their
engagement. As everyone has said, this is an opportunity to
improve the lives of people in this country who have
disabilities. In too many places, including those represented by
members of the Committee, those people are wholly reliant on
taxis and private hire vehicles to assist them in getting around,
so the rights in the Bill will make a real difference. I am
grateful to hon. Friends and Opposition Members for their
involvement in the Bill, which I hope will make further progress
in its remaining stages.
Question put and agreed to.
Clause 1 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 2 to 6 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Bill to be reported, without amendment.
