Northern Ireland: Jewish Community
Question
12:39:00
Asked by
Lord Dodds of Duncairn
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps they are taking to
address the concerns expressed by the Jewish community in
Northern Ireland about its future as a result of the operation of
the Protocol on Ireland/Northern Ireland.
(Con)
My Lords, we recognise the concerns raised on this matter. It is
a positive step that it was possible to agree with the EU a
sensible extension on chilled meats moving from Great Britain to
Northern Ireland until 30 September this year. This extension
means that Northern Ireland consumers will continue to be able to
buy chilled meat products, including kosher products, from Great
Britain, and allows for further discussions to continue on a
permanent basis.
Lord Dodds of Duncairn (DUP)
My Lords, the Jewish community in Belfast and Northern Ireland
has made, and continues to make, a very rich and compelling
contribution to the life of our country. Indeed, the sixth
President of the State of Israel, Chaim Herzog, was born in my
former constituency in north Belfast, and his son Isaac is the
current President of the State of Israel. Very worryingly, the
Chief Rabbi and Jewish leaders in Belfast have expressed great
concerns about the operation of the protocol and the continued
viability of the Jewish community. The Prime Minister has also
expressed concerns. The Minister referred to a grace period, but
that runs out in September. Will he give a guarantee that, in all
circumstances, he and the Government will take whatever measures
are necessary to guarantee the supply of kosher food into
Northern Ireland for the Jewish community?
(Con)
The noble Lord makes some very good points: it is vital that we
find a way to ensure that goods flow as freely as possible
between Great Britain and Northern Ireland, where they are
destined for Northern Ireland consumers, while ensuring that
goods moving onward into the EU are subject to the appropriate
requirements to ensure that EU rules are observed and the single
market protected. On the noble Lord’s point about the Jewish
community, it is a key focus for government to support that
community. I take note of the points he raises and, although I
cannot give a guarantee, every effort is being made to move
forward and find solutions to these problems.
(Lab)
My Lords, it is vital that Jewish people in Northern Ireland can
practise all aspects of their religion, including access to
kosher food. It is deeply regrettable that the Government have so
far failed to deliver a practical, long-term solution in the form
of a veterinary agreement. The Governments of Switzerland and New
Zealand have managed to secure such an agreement with the EU.
What does the Minister intend to do to ensure that freedom of
religion for Jewish communities in Northern Ireland is protected
through a veterinary agreement?
(Con)
The Jewish community has played an integral role in shaping the
journey and identity of this nation, particularly in Northern
Ireland. Our society is richer for its diversity and the Jewish
community is proud and shining testament to that. In answer to
the noble Baroness’s question, as I said earlier, every effort is
being made. UK and EU officials are engaging multiple times each
week to discuss the issues around the implementation of the
protocol. We also meet the EU regularly under the formal protocol
joint and special committee structure, with the most recent
meeting of the joint committee having taken place last month.
(LD) [V]
My Lords, does the Minister acknowledge that if the Government
had carried out a full impact assessment on the Northern Ireland
protocol before agreeing to it, many of these culturally
sensitive issues would have been highlighted? To push further on
the EU-UK veterinary agreement, does he not agree that this is
yet another issue that could be resolved by signing up to such an
agreement?
(Con)
I do not agree with some of the points that the noble Baroness
makes, because the protocol was really a compromise. It was
always clear that it was a delicate balance designed, crucially,
to support the Good Friday agreement and to maintain Northern
Ireland’s place in the UK while protecting the EU single market.
The question, of course, is how it is applied. I point out to her
that under the detail of the protocol, it is not simply about
putting a goods and customs border in place between Great Britain
and Northern Ireland. For example, Article 6(2) says that the UK
and EU
“shall use their best endeavours to facilitate the trade between
Northern Ireland and other parts of the United Kingdom … with a
view to avoiding controls at the ports and airports of Northern
Ireland to the extent possible”,
so we need to look at that.
(Con)
My Lords, as my noble friend Lord Dodds made clear, the Jewish
community has made a huge contribution to the city of Belfast,
including providing a unionist Lord Mayor as far back as 1899.
Does my noble friend the Minister agree that it would be both
tragic and outrageous if this latest crazy manifestation of the
EU’s implementation of the protocol now forces that community to
leave Northern Ireland altogether? How do supplies of kosher food
to a small Jewish population in any way threaten the integrity of
the EU single market?
(Con)
I do not disagree with my noble friend’s last point. Again, the
Jewish community has made an important contribution to society in
Northern Ireland. It is essential that that community receives
the kosher products that it requires, for eating and for
religious purposes. A key focus is to support the community in
this respect. As I said to the noble Lord, Lord Dodds, it is
vital that we find a way forward to ensure that these goods flow
smoothly.
(LD)
[V]
My Lords, why was this important issue not addressed by the
Government and their supporters before now? Can the Minister tell
us what meetings were held with the Jewish community in Northern
Ireland when the protocol was being negotiated by this
Government, and what did the Government tell that community about
how they would avoid the impeded access to kosher food, which has
a serious impact on the legally protected human right of
religious practice? If the Government will not solve this through
a veterinary agreement, as I and many others are calling for, how
will they solve it through negotiating a specific exemption? The
Government must pursue one route or the other.
(Con)
I do not have any information to hand as to what meetings took
place at the point when the protocol was being negotiated.
However, I can tell the noble Baroness that the Secretary of
State met the Jewish community last week and impressed upon it
that the Government were urgently seeking solutions to the flow
of important goods for that group.
(Con)
Although I welcome the extension for chilled meats between GB and
Northern Ireland, we are just kicking the can down the road. Will
my noble friend give a commitment that we will negotiate an SPS
agreement, such as has been agreed between New Zealand and the
EU? Will he further give the House a commitment today that there
is no threat to the availability of kosher or other such foods
from the protocol or any other legislation currently before the
House, such as the Animal Welfare (Sentience) Bill?
(Con)
My noble friend’s question takes us slightly beyond the immediate
subject. However, on supplies to supermarkets, which I think is
the gist of her question, a lot of work has gone on to ensure
that supplies continue to fill their shelves in Northern Ireland.
We announced in March that arrangements for supermarkets and
their suppliers who are trusted traders supplying food will
continue until October, meaning that they do not need to complete
health certificate paperwork. But as they have made clear to us,
notwithstanding the considerable government investment to support
these efforts, there are still some real challenges to sort out.
(UUP)
My Lords, the diverse country that Northern Ireland has become
over recent decades is a source of great local pride but, as the
noble Lords, Lord Dodds and , have said, there
is nothing new about the special place that the Jewish community
holds in Ulster, which dates back to the mid-18th century.
Speaking at a Policy Exchange event last week, the Northern
Ireland Secretary, , said:
“None of us can tolerate or be willing to accept”
a threat to the Province’s Jewish community because of the
protocol. If that is the case, why did the Prime Minister choose
to sign up to it?
(Con)
As I said earlier, the protocol was a compromise. We agreed
something exceptional, it is fair to say, to control goods moving
within our own country in the interest of peace—to apply EU law
in our own country without any democratic say beyond a vote, as
the House will know, in four years’ time. Again, that was in the
interest of peace. No other country has agreed to such a thing
and if it is to be sustainable, it must operate in a pragmatic
and proportionate way—not just like any other external border of
the single market.
(Con)
My Lords, there is a joke that the structure of Jewish holidays
can be simply put as: “They tried to kill us; we won; let’s eat”,
so availability of kosher food is important, especially to a
small community as in Northern Ireland. The Secretary of State
for Northern Ireland, the right honourable , is a true friend of the community, and I am grateful,
as has been said, that he found time to meet the Chief Rabbi and
the Board of Deputies last week. However, can my noble friend the
Minister assure me that the department will do whatever it can to
resolve this issue and allow the Jewish community to celebrate,
and eat?
(Con)
Perhaps a discussion on the importance of eating is for a
separate debate but I take the first point that my noble friend
made with the due seriousness it deserves. We are mindful that
many communities in Northern Ireland have specialised foods which
are deeply important to their culture and spiritual beliefs, and
we will always act to ensure that these are adequately supplied.
However, I assure my noble friend that, in the supermarkets we
have been in touch with, we are pleased to note that there is no
disruption at this time, although there were specific issues
during Passover which he will know about, and which DAERA and
Defra, working together, helped the sector to navigate.
The Lord Speaker ()
My Lords, the time allowed for this Question has elapsed.
