Asked by
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps they are taking to
enable children who commit offences to be tried and sentenced
according to the youth justice system, and in particular, those
who turn 18 before their first court appearance.
(Con)
My Lords, the courts are working to prioritise trials involving
youth defendants, particularly when they involve a child who is
about to turn 18. When a child turns 18 after an offence is
committed but before they appear in court, they must be tried as
an adult. However, guidelines state that in these cases courts
should use as a starting point a sentence that would have been
given at the time the offence was committed.
(Con) [V]
My Lords, delays, backlogs and where you live can mean that a
defendant who commits an offence under the age of 18 but who does
not attend their first court appearance before their 18th
birthday is treated differently from those who get to court
before they turn 18. Through no fault of their own, those
defendants miss out on receiving the valuable specialist youth
court provision and sentences, especially referral orders, which
can be vital in the rehabilitation and turning around of a young
person’s life and which I have witnessed as a former youth
magistrate. Will the Government consider reviewing this unfair
anomaly?
(Con)
My noble friend is correct that under current legislation, the
date of the hearing determines whether the defendant appears in a
youth court or in an adult court. However, she should not draw
the wrong conclusion. Measures exist in adult courts to support
defendants who are particularly vulnerable, and throughout court
proceedings consideration is given to the age of the defendant.
Like referral orders in youth courts, community order
requirements for adults can also be tailored to address an
offender’s needs and support their rehabilitation. Finally, HMCTS
is working to increase the throughput of cases in the courts and,
while listing is a matter for the judiciary, youth cases have
been prioritised to ensure that they are listed as expediently as
possible, especially when a child is almost 18.
(Con) [V]
My Lords, the most recent official data show that 1,400 offences
a year are committed by children who turn 18 prior to the trial.
That number is rising, to some extent understandably, because of
Covid delays, which means that the flexibilities and some of the
specialities of the youth justice system are lost to these
defendants. It is a serious issue. What are the Government doing,
particularly with regard to the backlog because of Covid?
(Con)
The youth justice working group, chaired by the judicial lead on
youth justice, has been set up exactly to reduce the impact of
Covid-19 delays on the youth court and trials involving youths in
the Crown Court. This group continues to meet regularly to
carefully monitor the youth recovery programme, and its highlight
for this year is to continue to make sure that the lists are as
low as possible for a child, particularly if they are just about
to turn 18.
(CB)
[V]
My Lords, are the Government considering raising the age of
criminal responsibility from 10 to 12? These 10 and 11 year-olds
usually come from seriously dysfunctional backgrounds and need
help in the care system rather than convictions or findings of
guilt.
(Con)
I have no information that the age will rise from 10 to 12 but
that may be debated in the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts
Bill, which is in the other place and will be coming to this
House shortly.
(Lab)
[V]
Not enough is known about the number or experience of Gypsy,
Traveller and Roma young people in the criminal justice system
except that the number is significantly large in relation to
their very small population. Is the Minister aware of a recent
Justice report on racial disparity in the experience of young
people in the criminal justice system? In particular, would she
endorse its recommendation that the Ministry of Justice collects
and makes available all data to a much greater extent, and
endorse recommendation 16—that the criminal justice agencies
should improve their relationship with Gypsy, Traveller and Roma
community groups and follow the Traveller Movement recommendation
on how to do so?
(Con)
The noble Baroness is correct about the report, which I read for
another Question I was answering quite recently. Absolutely—every
effort should be made by the whole of the judicial system to work
with the Gypsy, Traveller and Roma communities. We want a justice
system that is fair and open and where no person suffers
discrimination.
(LD) [V]
My Lords, the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Butler-Sloss, is
right to raise the question of the age of criminal
responsibility, which at 10 years is the lowest in this part of
the world. Can the Minister look at the Private Member’s Bill
which I promoted previously in this House, and which had a safe
passage, to see what lessons could be learned to ensure that
young people do not end up in the criminal justice system?
(Con)
The noble Lord is absolutely right: we need to keep an eye on
timings and where these communities are. However, we also need to
make sure that we do everything we possibly can through education
and support to make sure that children do not come into the
system in the first place.
(Lab) [V]
My Lords, the backlog in the national referral mechanism was
growing before the first lockdown and has grown at a faster rate
during the past year. How long can youths and youth courts expect
to wait for an NRM review, and does the Minister agree that
excessive waits are not in the interests of justice or of the
youths concerned?
(Con)
The Government are working to achieve quicker and more certain
decision-making for victims of modern slavery but also youths.
The Single Competent Authority was launched in April 2019 to
handle all national referral mechanism cases and to provide
high-quality, timely decisions for victims. There has been a
significant ongoing recruitment of SCA decision-makers to address
timescales. There are no set timescale or target decisions to be
made; the SCA can make a conclusive grounds decision only when
sufficient information has been made available by the parties
involved in all cases.
(GP)
My Lords, part of the problem with all the delays and children
becoming adults before they go to court is because the
Conservative Government massively cut funding to courts. The
Minister comes from the Ministry of Justice but this is a clear
injustice. What will the Ministry of Justice do about it?
(Con)
I think I have answered this question once before. HMCTS is
working to clear the youth court backlog at pace. The
magistrates’ courts, where most youth cases are heard, disposed
of more cases than they received from August 2020, which has led
to a reduction in the outstanding caseload.
(CB) [V]
[Inaudible]—the Minister to my noble and learned friend Lady
Butler-Sloss indicates that the important question of the age of
criminal responsibility may be raised in the Bill which is at
present in the other place.
(Con)
I do not think I heard the whole question from the noble Lord,
but if it is about the age in law, I have answered that question
before. If that is an issue, the Police, Crime, Sentencing and
Courts Bill, which is coming from the other place shortly, will
be the place to discuss it fully in this House.
(Lab)
[V]
My Lords, when there is an admission of guilt and the offender is
under 18 at the date of disposal, there is a strong presumption
in favour of diverting to an out-of-court disposal. This does not
apply if the offender reaches their 18th birthday after the crime
occurred but before their first court appearance. Does the
Minister not agree that that is arbitrary, unjust and probably
not in the public interest? How difficult would it be to correct
the anomaly?
(Con)
The noble Lord has a point here, but the youth courts look after
very young children, who have very different needs from young
adults. Special measures exist in the youth courts that are
intended to protect young children. Throughout court proceedings,
however, consideration is given to the age of the defendant,
whatever it is, including in the adult courts. It is important
that we realise that there are systems within the adult courts to
look after these young people. But the noble Lord is correct in
saying that this is an issue that needs to be discussed, and I
suggest that it should be discussed in the passage of the
forthcoming Bill.
