Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green) (Urgent Question): To
ask the Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero if she
will provide an update on the UK Government’s commitments in
relation to COP28. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for
Energy Security and Net Zero (Amanda Solloway) I am glad to come to
the House to discuss this important subject today. The upcoming COP
hosted by the United Arab Emirates is an important moment in the
climate...Request free trial
(Brighton, Pavilion)
(Green)
(Urgent Question): To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
Security and Net Zero if she will provide an update on the UK
Government’s commitments in relation to COP28.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security
and Net Zero ()
I am glad to come to the House to discuss this important subject
today. The upcoming COP hosted by the United Arab Emirates is an
important moment in the climate crisis. Amid record temperatures
and emissions, the first comprehensive stocktake of progress
against the Paris agreement at COP28 will show that the world is
badly off-track. We have made significant progress through the
Paris agreement, with temperature projections shifting from 4°C
before Paris to between 2.4°C and 2.7°C after Glasgow through
nationally determined contribution commitments, but we know that
that is not enough.
In Glasgow, we cemented the goal of limiting global temperature
increases to 1.5°C as our north star. That has been carried
forward by the UAE presidency. The latest science and the impacts
we are seeing, even at 1.1°C, show us why. A top priority for the
United Kingdom is to leave COP28 with a clear road map towards
keeping 1.5°C in reach from the global stocktake. The UK heads to
COP28 with a record at home and internationally that we can be
proud of. The Prime Minister recently affirmed our commitment to
net zero and set out our new approach to get there. At home, we
have decarbonised faster than any other major economy—by 48%
since 1990. Looking forward, our 2030 target requires the largest
reduction in emissions of any major economy.
Two years on from Glasgow, the need to accelerate action is more
urgent than ever. The world needs to decarbonise more than five
times faster than we have done in the last two decades. At COP28,
we want to see progress against five areas: ambitious new
commitments and action, including a pathway to keep 1.5°C within
reach from the global stocktake; scaling up clean energy through
commitments to triple renewables, double energy efficiency and
move beyond fossil fuels; progress on finance reform, delivering
$100 billion for developing economies; building resilience to
climate impacts, including by doubling adaptation finance and
establishing a loss and damage fund; and, finally, progress on
restoring nature. Action to deliver net zero is not just a matter
of doing the right thing by avoiding harm; it is crucial to our
security and prosperity here in the UK now and in the future.
The global net zero transition could be worth £1 trillion to UK
businesses between 2021 and 2030. UK businesses are in the
vanguard in recognising the opportunity. More than two thirds of
FTSE 100 companies, and thousands of small businesses, have
pledged to reduce their emissions in line with the 1.5°C goal
under the Race to Zero campaign. More than half the signatories
to that campaign are from the United Kingdom. Net zero is already
an engine for growth and revitalisation of formerly
deindustrialised areas in the United Kingdom. At COP28 we need to
show progress in delivering the historic agreement that we landed
in Glasgow, and we must use our UK expertise to scale green
finance.
I thank the Minister for her response. COP28 will be the most
consequential climate summit since COP21 in Paris, yet we are way
off track. The UN’s recent emissions gap report warns that
current pledges under the Paris agreement would see temperature
rises of between 2.5°C and 2.9°C this century. Ministers are fond
of saying that the UK has the most ambitious nationally
determined contribution for 2030 of any major economy, yet the
Minister will also be aware of the Climate Change Committee’s
recent assessment that
“the UK is unlikely to meet its NDC”.
That is not least because the committee calculates that just 28%
of the required emission reductions for 2030 are covered by
credible Government plans. She will know that targets without
plans are cheap. What concrete plans do the Government have to
urgently close that gap? Does she agree that we must see an
ambitious outcome from the global stocktake, with significantly
strengthened 2030 NDCs and new economy-wide targets by 2025 that
see the richest countries going further and faster?
Does the Minister share my outrage over reports that the UAE
plans to use its role as COP28 president to secure oil and gas
deals? What assessment has she made of the impact of that on
trust in the negotiations? Will she explain why the UK is pushing
for the phase-out of unabated fossil fuels, rather than of fossil
fuels in their entirety? Does she recognise the view of the High
Ambition Coalition, which says that we cannot use abatement
technologies to “green-light” fossil fuel expansion? How will she
ensure that any agreement that includes language on abatement has
real teeth, delivers real cuts in fossil fuel production, and
does not simply allow for the continuation of business as
usual?
The Minister will know that a properly resourced and operational
loss and damage finance fund must be a litmus test for success at
COP28, but there are reports that the Government will be
contributing to that fund from their existing climate finance
pot. Does she agree that we cannot tackle ever-increasing
challenges from an ever-depleting pot of money? What plans do the
Government have for new and additional finance? What innovative
sources of finance are they looking at? What assessment have they
made of the impact of the UK’s reclassification of climate
finance on climate vulnerable countries? If the Government are
serious about leading by example, will they finally reverse the
greenlighting of the obscene Rosebank oilfield?
I reiterate that the Government take this issue incredibly
seriously, and there are two ways of demonstrating that: the
Minister for Energy Security and Net Zero, my right hon. Friend
the Member for Beverley and Holderness (), who usually deals with such
issues, is at COP28 and ready for the conference; and we now have
a distinct Department for this issue, the Department for Energy
Security and Net Zero. We know that we are leaders in the field.
I take this issue seriously, not just for the people of the
United Kingdom, but for the planet as a whole. Thinking about my
granddaughter, we really do have a commitment to ensuring that we
are doing everything that we can.
Mr Speaker
I call Dr Thérèse Coffey. [Interruption.] Order. Ms Lucas, I have
given you an urgent question. If you have a problem—
There were no answers!
Mr Speaker
Please. The Minister will answer as she sees fit. I am sure that
at the end you will want to raise a point of order. That is the
time—you cannot have a second bite of the cherry. I went out of
my way to ensure that this issue was covered, so please—I am sure
other Members will ask questions, and it is up to the Minister
how she answers them. I am not responsible for that.
Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con)
Thank you, Mr Speaker, for granting this second opportunity for
the House to discuss COP28. At the debate on 16 November, when
the Government granted a full day’s debate, only three Back
Benchers spoke—me, and the hon. Members for Putney () and for Strangford (). There was not a sign of the hon. Member for
Brighton, Pavilion (), who is now complaining
about the responses to her questions. By the way, the debate on
16 November finished early because of how few people spoke.
Does my hon. Friend agree that “vote blue, go green” is the best
way to deliver net zero? Does she recognise that nature-based
solutions are vital to achieve net zero? Does this not just show
again that the Green party is all talk and absolutely no
action?
As I have said, it is incredibly important that we head towards
our commitments. Between 1990 and 2021, we cut UK emissions by
48% while growing the economy. I agree with my right hon. Friend
that if we trust this Government to deliver, we will ensure we
are heading on the right path. The other thing to mention is that
net zero is an engine for growth and the revitalisation of
formerly industrialised areas of the UK. Cutting emissions is
important not just for the climate, but for our economy.
Mr Speaker
I call the shadow Minister.
(Bristol East) (Lab)
The UN has warned that the world is on course for a catastrophic
2.8°C of warming, in part because promises made at COP26 and
COP27 have not been fulfilled. We are running out of last
chances. We know what we need to do and we know how to do it, but
where is the sense of urgency? The Prime Minister was shamed into
attending COP last year. I would have thought he would be ashamed
to be there this year, after his climate climbdown last month
derailed momentum at exactly the wrong time. The world needs
climate leadership.
Does the Minister think it is acceptable for the Prime Minister
to sabotage the UK’s history of climate leadership with his
cynical backtracking on net zero? Labour will be going to COP
with a message that the UK can be a climate leader again and
that, in doing so, we will cut energy bills and boost energy
independence at home, which this Government have conspicuously
failed to do. Labour will put the UK back in a position of
leadership and establish a clean power alliance. We will pledge
to issue no new oil, gas or coal licences and set an example with
our mission for clean power by 2030. What example does it set if
the current UK Government ignore the science and global consensus
on fossil fuels, especially when the Energy Secretary admits that
her policy will not even cut bills?
Labour will also be working for multilateral development bank
reform to help developing countries access capital, as well as
championing the UK as the future green finance capital of the
world, with mandatory 1.5°C-aligned transition plans for FTSE 100
companies and financial institutions. Can the Minister tell me
what the Government will be doing to advance that agenda?
There is so much more that the UK can and must do to reduce
emissions and deliver energy security, to cut energy bills and to
back British industry. With Labour, Britain would lead the world
at COP. Labour is ready to lead; is the Minister?
As I have mentioned, we do take this issue incredibly seriously.
If I think about some of the facts, as the hon. Member rightly
mentioned, at the G20 the Prime Minister announced $2 billion to
the green climate fund. That is the biggest single funding
commitment that the UK has made to help the world tackle climate
change. Half of that contribution will go to adaptation. We are
committed, and that is why we have a presence at COP28. The House
will see that senior members of the UK Government are there, as
well as King Charles.
(Chipping Barnet)
(Con)
This country has one of the strongest records in the world on
reducing emissions, not least given our very successful COP26
summit in Glasgow. What progress is being made on delivering the
historic commitment to tackling deforestation made by the leaders
at that summit?
I pay tribute to the work that my right hon. Friend has done on
this subject. I will need to get back to her with the exact
figures on deforestation, if I may. One of the things that the UK
Government are doing at COP28 is making sure that we hit the five
key areas of progress: finance, global stocktake, mitigation,
adaptation, and loss and damage—and, within that, nature.
Mr Speaker
I call the SNP spokesperson.
(Coatbridge, Chryston and
Bellshill) (SNP)
The UK Government’s series of U-turns on net zero targets has put
our ability to meet them at risk. The Scottish Government are
committed to meeting our more ambitious targets, but Europe and
the United States are leading the way as this place lags behind,
in turn holding Scotland back. Can the Minister confirm whether
the new Foreign Secretary, who famously decided to “cut the green
crap”, will be attending COP26? That move cost UK households £2.5
billion in extra energy costs.
I reassure the hon. Gentleman that we are committed to ensuring
we hit all those targets. As of September 2022, more than 130
countries, accounting for around 85% of global emissions and more
than 90% of global GDP, were covered by net zero commitments. We
are committed to making sure that we hit those targets, and that
is demonstrated by our attendance at COP28 and the measures we
are taking to ensure we meet the climate challenges.
(Amber Valley) (Con)
The Government’s “Mobilising green investment” strategy,
published in March, set out that we need $1 trillion a year in
green finance by 2030. What are the Government’s ambitions at
COP28 to agree funding anywhere close to that level? What more
can we do to get our private sector and pension schemes to
contribute to that?
My hon. Friend makes an important point. We will have those
discussions over the two weeks of COP28. We are trying to ensure
that we hit all the global targets, too. I am sure that those
conversations will come up, and we can have a discussion on them
later.
(Cardiff North) (Lab)
The Minister can talk the talk, but it is action that counts.
Businesses across every sector, as well as experts in the field,
have reacted with horror to this Government’s backsliding and
roll-backs on climate action and net zero. In fact, Aviva’s chief
executive, Amanda Blanc, said that the Government were putting
our climate goals as a country “under threat” and therefore jobs,
growth and investment at risk. Does the Minister recognise the
damage that is doing both at home and to our global standing?
One of the things that this Government are committed to is
ensuring that we have skills in place and that the economy is
going in the right direction. We are proud of our record, and our
commitment to making sure we get to net zero is demonstrated in
all the things we have been doing. We are international
leaders—world leaders—in our commitment to ensuring that we hit
those targets.
(St Ives) (Con)
I welcome that two of the 34 new landscape recovery schemes are
in west Cornwall and on Scilly, and I credit the Cornwall
Wildlife Trust, Farm Cornwall, the Duchy, other organisations and
in particular the landowners for their incredible work to achieve
that. At previous climate change conferences, specifically the
Paris summit, we agreed to fix our leaky homes. Will the Minister
meet me to discuss how we can accelerate that effort, especially
for low-income families?
I know what a champion my hon. Friend is for his constituents. I
will of course meet him, although perhaps a meeting with the
relevant Minister would be more appropriate. We are committed to
making sure that we have that extra security. That is why we are
making such an investment in working towards energy security,
while at the same time working towards net zero.
(Bath) (LD)
The UK was a leader in offshore wind development but is now
falling seriously behind. Costs to offshore wind developers have
increased by as much as 40%. The recent offshore wind auction
failure will have cost the UK 5 GW of new renewable energy, and
that was entirely predictable. How will the Prime Minister be
able to look in the eye the leaders of countries that are
suffering most from the impact of climate change and say, “The UK
does everything it can”?
First, we are world leaders on offshore energy. That is one of
our commitments, but we do not just rest on our laurels and think
about offshore wind; we are also looking at other ways to
generate electricity, which is much needed, including fusion and
small modular reactors. The hon. Lady suggests we are not taking
into account where we should be going on energy, but we are world
leaders and we are ensuring that we have an impact on our
futures.
(Chelmsford) (Con)
I am looking forward to going to COP as one of the members of the
Energy Security and Net Zero Committee. Last week the Committee
went to see the world’s first green hydrogen neighbourhood
project in Fife in Scotland. Local people were given the choice
to switch to innovative clean green hydrogen heating and nearly
half of them have taken that choice. Does the Minister agree that
one of the biggest challenges to achieving next zero is achieving
that consumer change, and that this is why it is so important
that we offer consumers innovation and choice rather than the
top-down “tax and ban” approach that the Opposition so often
promote?
My hon. Friend makes an important point. It is about education;
ensuring that people are educated and thinking about how we use
our future energy. However, it is also incumbent on us to ensure
that we offer choices, which is why we are committed to offshore
and to making sure that we are investing in science and
technology and getting all of that technology available, thus
making energy available in lots of different forms.
(Islington North) (Ind)
After the last COP, the Prime Minister at the time, , assured the House that there
would be no funding whatsoever from British sources for fossil
fuel developments anywhere in the world. Since then, the UK
Government have announced their own fossil fuel developments with
oil and gas extraction, so how on earth does the Minister expect
to be taken seriously at COP when Britain itself is investing
more in fossil fuels and then lecturing the rest of the world
that they should not do so? Can she assure us that this COP is
not just going to be an exercise in greenwash with a sideshow of
oil dealing, and that it is going to be a serious attempt to deal
with the serious, fundamental issues that this planet faces?
Yes, UK production is declining. When we think about oil and gas,
it is important that we think about having a balanced approach
and making sure that we keep our supply going as it should. One
of the things we are committed to is making sure that, on
balance, we also have other options available. It is important to
remember that, from an economic point of view, the jobs that are
created are really important, from an oil and gas point of view,
and of course that will be invested in green energy as well, so
it is a cyclical thing to make sure that we are investing in our
future.
(Bosworth) (Con)
Having spent a year in the Energy Department, it has been an
absolute pleasure to see how civil servants, businesses, the
public and, indeed, Ministers are at the forefront of ensuring
that the UK is the major economy that has decarbonised furthest
and fastest in the world. We account for only 1% of emissions. We
have the biggest offshore wind farm in the world, as well as the
second biggest and the third biggest. We have more solar panels
than France. We really are leading the way. So when we go to COP,
we need to make sure that others see that there is an advantage
in doing this and join us on that journey. What will the
Minister’s message be at COP to make sure that the world joins us
on this journey?
I thank my hon. Friend for making those points. He has worked
closely with the Department and seen at first hand the work that
we have been doing, and it is good to hear that reiterated in the
House. One of the things that we are looking for is success at
COP28, and success would be making sure that we are supporting
those five measures but also progressing and making sure that we
have a commitment to the world’s future and making a greener
climate.
(Leeds East) (Lab)
The Government are going into these global climate talks having
announced new North sea oil and gas fields. If every country
copied this Government’s approach of squeezing out every last
drop of oil and gas, we would risk extreme global temperature
rises of 3°C. Every respected climate body has warned of the
dangers of this approach, so at the climate talks why should any
other country listen to this Government when their policies are
not compatible with the UK’s own climate commitments?
Of course we are committed to doing other things as well, which
is what I am reiterating. We have a commitment to making sure
that we learn from research and development, and that we are
looking at offshore wind, but we also need to be realistic, which
is why we are looking at oil and gas. It will have an impact on
the economy and it will help towards a greener economy because of
the investment that will be made through the oil and gas
finance.
(Bournemouth East) (Con)
Climate change is the single biggest threat to humanity, and I
will be looking forward to attending COP28 myself. I am pleased
that it is taking place in the middle east, given the need to
transition away from fossil fuels. We seem to forget our own
history, because it was us—in Persia, in Mesopotamia and on the
Arab peninsula—that got the middle east on to the road of oil and
gas exploration. Does my hon. Friend agree that we are able to
get our CO2 emissions down today because of the offshore wind
farms in the English channel, and that those are the result of a
lot of investment from the United Arab Emirates?
It is always a great pleasure to listen to my right hon. Friend,
who reminds us of the history and of how we got to this point.
However, we need to acknowledge all the good things that we are
doing, and I reiterate that we are looking at ensuring sure that
we have a secure energy future.
(Orkney and Shetland)
(LD)
Is it not just a little bit embarrassing that as Ministers head
to the Gulf for COP, the European Marine Energy Centre in my
constituency is having to consult on downsizing and restructuring
because the Minister’s colleagues in the Department of Levelling
Up, Housing and Communities have been unable to provide the
three-year funding stream that they had previously undertaken to
provide? Will she speak to her colleagues in DLUHC to ensure that
some certainty on that money can be given, and that the centre
can continue its genuinely world-leading work on the development
of marine renewable energy?
That is obviously not my Department, but I would be happy to take
that away and facilitate a meeting, or indeed have a meeting
myself.
(Belfast South) (SDLP)
New research by Ulster University finds that over 60% of homes in
Northern Ireland will need to be retrofitted if we are to have a
chance of meeting our net zero targets, and that at the current
rate of retrofitting we have no chance of meeting our 2030 goals.
Does the Minister believe that the support available to
providers, such as the Northern Ireland Housing Executive and
housing associations across the region, is adequate to allow them
to tackle the climate breakdown and fuel poverty? Further,
knowing the impact of climate change on the poorest countries in
the world, will the Government finally make real the loss and
damage fund to help those most affected to adapt and mitigate,
and will she ensure that that fund is new money and not just a
raid on existing pressed aid budgets?
With the hon. Lady’s permission, I would prefer to write to her,
because parts of those questions are slightly outside my remit.
However, I reiterate that one of the things we are determined to
do is tackle fuel poverty. That is one of the reasons why we have
a commitment to do this. Also, there is a lot of support that
people can get, and I would encourage everybody to get what they
are entitled to.
(Mid Bedfordshire)
(Lab)
I have some great green innovators in my constituency, but it has
been heartbreaking speaking to them over the last few months
about the impact that the Government’s supposed reset on net zero
is having on their businesses. They include new fuel cell
producers, green aviation leaders, companies providing key supply
chain parts to the car industry and renewable energy companies.
Their businesses may be different, but the story is the same. The
lack of action from the Government is making it harder for them
to get investment, harder for them to create jobs and harder for
them to bring growth to Mid Bedfordshire. My constituents
ultimately saw through the Government’s shallow positioning on
this issue, hearteningly for me, but it is unfortunate that this
issue continues to hang over their prospects. How can we show
leadership on this issue at COP28 at a time when the Government
cannot even get out of the way of people looking to bring growth
to my constituents?
This Government have demonstrated a commitment to investment in
all these areas. Particularly from a science and technology point
of view, I know that UK Trade and Investment has immense
commitment and gives out support for this. But there are many
things that we have been doing. We have not just been investing
in R&D from a science point of view. What we are doing is
investing in offshore wind, in alternative fuel and in all those
things that will enable us to get to where we need to be.
(Tiverton and Honiton)
(LD)
In the UK, heating homes accounts for 14% of carbon emissions,
and in England our homes produce more emissions than cars do.
That is not only costing the environment in the future; it is
also costing taxpayers now. A decade ago, the then Prime Minister
Cameron’s “green crap” riddance resulted in uninsulated lofts and
in cavity walls being left unfilled. Given that that decision is
now adding billions in additional costs to taxpayers and making
it harder to meet the 2030 decarbonisation target, can the
Minister ask the Foreign Secretary whether he regrets it?
We are investing in making sure that homes are insulated and
energy efficient. It is worth pointing out that between 1990 and
2021 the UK cut emissions by 48%, while growing the economy by
more than 70%. I can, of course, pass on the hon. Gentleman’s
message to the Foreign Secretary.
Points of Order
1.09pm
(Bootle) (Lab)
On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I would appreciate any
advice you can give me on a matter of great interest and concern
to my constituents. It relates to the attitude of National
Highways officials in the north-west office. A freedom of
information request revealed several emails that, in my view,
show a worrying lack of candour and transparency in National
Highways’ dealings with me in relation to the replacement of a
footbridge on a major road in my constituency. In particular, I
have been accused of “whipping up a frenzy” among my constituents
in relation to that important safety matter—I am doing my job,
not whipping up a frenzy. Any advice from you would be
welcome.
Madam Deputy Speaker ( )
I thank the hon. Gentleman for giving me notice of his point of
order. I certainly agree that he, or any other Member, should not
be criticised for pursuing issues of concern to their
constituents. The hon. Gentleman has put his concerns on the
record, and I believe the Minister may wish to make a quick
point.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport ()
Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. The hon.
Member for Bootle () was kind enough to notify me
of his intention to make a point of order and I have already
begun the process of looking into it. It is fair to say that he
is a friend of mine, although I know that many will hold that
against him. He is merely doing his job, and I will make sure
that that continues.
Madam Deputy Speaker
I was about to say that the hon. Gentleman might want to consider
raising the issue with Ministers, but that has already happened.
I am grateful to the Minister, and I am sure that the issue will
be considered between the two of them.
(Brighton, Pavilion)
(Green)
On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I was very grateful to
Mr Speaker for granting my urgent question, but do you have any
advice on what can be done when a Minister simply refuses to
answer a single question and essentially abuses the procedures of
the House? I asked 12 questions in good faith. The Minister was
on her feet for 49 seconds, during which time we learned that the
Secretary of State is at COP, that there is a Department for
Energy Security and Net Zero, and that the Minister’s
granddaughter cares a lot about the planet. That is all very
fascinating but it did not answer a single one of my questions.
How can we do our jobs as Members holding the Government to
account when Ministers can stand at the Dispatch Box for 49
seconds and not answer a single question on an issue deemed
worthy of an urgent question?
Madam Deputy Speaker
I thank the hon. Lady for her point of order, but I am not
responsible for the answers given by Ministers. I believe the
Minister would like to say something.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security
and Net Zero ()
Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I believed
that I had answered most of the questions the hon. Lady asked in
my opening remarks. My understanding was that I was to give a
short response. If there is anything I have not responded to, I
am happy to respond in writing. My right hon. Friend the Member
for Suffolk Coastal (Dr Coffey) made the important point that
there have been previous debates on this issue, and I suggest
that if the hon. Lady had turned up to those debates, she would
have been able to have a fuller—[Hon. Members: “Hear, hear.”]
Madam Deputy Speaker
Order. I thank the Minister for that response. Both the hon. Lady
and the Minister have put their views on the record. I am sure
that there will be further opportunities after the summit for the
issues to be discussed.
rose—
Madam Deputy Speaker
I do not want to prolong this exchange, but I will allow a very
brief point.
On the point made by the right hon. Member for Suffolk Coastal
(Dr Coffey) and just now by the Minister, they will know that
there is one person representing my party and I cannot be in two
places at once—I am working on it! There are 350 Conservative
Members, and just one Back Bencher was at the debate last week. I
suggest that they look at getting their own house in order before
criticising this side.
Madam Deputy Speaker
This is getting way beyond anything resembling a point of order,
so we should move on swiftly.
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