Oral questions in the Lords on musicians working in the EU

Baroness Barran [00:01:23] My Lords, the government recognizes the importance of international touring for the whole range of UK cultural and creative practitioners. The Secretary of State has committed to creating a DCMS-led working group to work closely with the sector's representative organisations and other key government departments to assist businesses and individuals as far as possible to work confidently in the EU. And that group met for the first time on the 20th of January.

Earl of Clancarty [00:02:00] Does the Minister find it acceptable that artists from countries across the globe, such as Colombia and the United Arab Emirates, have through the standard visa waiver agreement, potentially better access to the EU than ourselves, the EU's next-door neighbour? What steps are the government taking to proactively engage with the EU in finding a solution to touring arrangements in Europe, having to deal individually with 27 EU countries and even as in Belgium and Germany, regions within countries doesn't cut it. It is the last thing the music sector wants.

Baroness Barran [00:02:37] The noble earl is right to highlight some of the challenges that now face our brilliant musicians and creative artists. As he knows, in the UK-EU trade negotiations, the EU tabled a proposal for a permanent waiver for short stays covering UK and EU citizens, which drew on agreements such as that with Colombia and the UAE. However, this offer would not have met the needs of touring musicians in the round, and nor was it compatible with our manifesto commitment to take back control of our borders. And therefore our starting point is to listen to and work with the sector and make sure they have the information they need in a clear and accessible way so that they can continue their valuable work once covid restrictions are lifted.

Baroness Bakewell [00:03:42] The countries cited by my friend the Noble Earl have a unilateral agreement with the EU which makes their relationship possible. So will the government now please seek their own new bilateral agreement with the EU and the EU member states quite separate from the trade agreement so that they can exempt touring performers and creative people from the visa and work permit regulations?

Baroness Barran [00:04:15] As the noble lady has heard me say on several occasions that this dispatch box, we are exploring options individually to try and ease the process for our musicians and creative artists. But there are no current plans such as the Noble Lady suggests.

Baroness Bonham-Carter of Yardley [00:04:41] I welcome the dialogue between the noble Baroness, the minister's department and the industry. My Lords, it's not just musicians, but professionals from other creative industries that rely on touring and are facing this extra bureaucracy when moving between the EU and the UK. Can the noble Baroness the minister say whether moving equipment, musical instruments, scenery, merchandise, artifacts by track or cargo will require carnets between Great Britain and Northern Ireland? The Northern Ireland protocol makes no mention of temporary import export.

Baroness Barran [00:05:25] If I may, given the sensitivities around arrangements in Northern Ireland at the moment, I will double check and confirm to the noble lady. But my understanding is that artists and organisations based in Northern Ireland will not be required to obtain carnets or musical instrument certificates when touring in the EU because the Northern Ireland protocol means that Northern Ireland is part of that regulatory environment.

Lord Vaizey of Didcot [00:06:04] Half our musicians earn half their income in the European Union and to echo the noble Lord, the Earl of Clancarty, I would add that Tonga and St Lucia also have visa waiver agreements with the European Union. Is it the government's position that Tonga and St Lucia do not have control over their borders and therefore should now turn their backs on their visa waiver scheme? Or will the government see sense and pursue a bilateral agreement for a visa waiver scheme for our musicians?

Baroness Barran [00:06:37] Well, this government isn't responsible for any of the visa arrangements for any of the countries that my noble friend refers to. We do recognize that this requires additional requirements that will need to be met to tour and work in the EU for our cultural professionals. Some member states allow touring without a permit. Others will require a preapproved visa and or a work permit. And we are undertaking an extensive program of engagement with our sectors to find the best way through.

Baroness Bull [00:07:20] The deal presents challenges across all art forms and the 10 person dance circus company Motion House exemplifies. It is currently negotiating a 56 show tour at 20 venues in 11 EU countries. The additional costs of carnets, permits and visas rise to £37,000 and this is on top of new admin costs and in-country taxes. Is the noble baroness tthe minister aware the company will also need to monitor any holidays they dance in the Schengen area. If they push any one of them over the 90 days allowed, it could be forced to cancel or refuse bookings. What advice can she offer this company and many like it so that it can continue to promote UK creativity to the world as it's done for 33 years?

Baroness Barran [00:08:06] I congratulate the company on what they've achieved over the last 33 years. And we are all proud in this house of the work of our creative colleagues. In terms of advice to them, I would suggest that they work through their own industry body to make sure that within the department we are hearing issues that they face and we can feed that into the solutions we are trying to find.

[00:08:49] I have an uncomfortable feeling that we've gone backwards from where we were a couple of weeks ago when she last answered a question in the heart on this subject. Is she saying that the government now has no intention of further engagement with the EU or EU member states in order to try to get a better outcome for the many performers and performing arts organisations who are faced with these new restrictions? If so, is that not a counsel of despair?

Baroness Barran [00:09:22] I really hope it's not a counsel of despair. As I've said earlier in this House, there is scope to return to the issue in the future should the EU change its mind. We were very clear on what we tried to achieve. That ambitious request was based on advice we received from musicians and the creative industries more broadly, and we can't go back from what they have told us they need. But the government is looking at whether we can work with our partners in EU member states to find ways to make life easier for them in the meantime.

Lord Strasburger [00:10:05] A year ago, the Creative Industries Minister told the Commons that music tours are the lifeblood of the industry. It is absolutely essential, he said, that free movement for artists is protected post 2020. Fine words, my lords, but what's the reality? The creative arts were completely ignored in the EU trade deal. One of our stellar export industries has been butchered by this botched negotiation. Why haven't the government gone back to Brussels to fix this mess?

Baroness Barran [00:10:40] I really cannot accept the noble Lord's assertion that these industries were ignored. Our negotiators worked extremely hard to try and put forward a proposal which would have benefited both the EU and the UK creative sectors, and we're disappointed they didn't accept it.

Lord Bowness [00:11:05] This is an issue which is much wider than just musicians, although that's clearly extraordinarily important. I'm amazed we're only having discussions with the industry on the 20th of January because this is an issue which has been around for a long time. On the 20th of December, the Noble Lord Lord True told me that the most ambitious agreement on movement was rejected by the EU. But in March last year, the Home Office told me that the arrangements were not dependent on whether or not the government concluded a free trade agreement with the European Union. On the 5th of May. I was told it depended on both. My question, which I raised in the debate on the 8th of January, was, does this have to be negotiated with the EU or the individual states? And if the latter, how many of the 27 have we approached and are engaged with in negotiations?

Baroness Barran [00:12:05] To clarify for my noble friend, our work with the industry did not start on the 20th January and I'm sorry if I wasn't clear on that point. The secretary of state has established a new group, Round Table, who met for the first time. But all of our work in this area has been informed by feedback from the sector. In relation to the Noble Lords wider points, if I may, I will respond in writing.