Asked by Lord Naseby To ask Her Majesty’s Government what
plans they have to ban the sale of new (1) diesel, (2) petrol, (3)
hybrid, and (4) electric, cars over the next 25 years. The
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Transport
(Baroness Sugg) (Con) My Lords, the Government’s aim is for
every new car and van to be effectively...Request free trial
Asked by
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To ask Her Majesty’s Government what plans they have to ban
the sale of new (1) diesel, (2) petrol, (3) hybrid, and (4)
electric, cars over the next 25 years.
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for
Transport (Baroness Sugg) (Con)
My Lords, the Government’s aim is for every new car and van
to be effectively zero emission by 2040 and we will end the
sale of new conventional petrol and diesel cars and vans by
this date. We expect this transition to be industry and
consumer-led, but will consider intervening if not enough
progress is being made. Our approach is focused on the goal
of zero tailpipe emissions and is technology-neutral. More
detail will be set out in the forthcoming zero-emission
road transport strategy.
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(Con)
I thank my noble friend for that Answer but, given that all
Governments are poor at forecasting—and in this industry,
diesels come to mind—would it not make much more sense for
Her Majesty’s Government to stop trying to dictate and
rather to listen and work with the relevant industry? In
this case, was not the CEO of the Society of Motor
Manufacturers and Traders right when he said,
“industry cannot dictate the pace of change nor levels of
consumer demand. Unrealistic targets and misleading
messaging on bans will only undermine our efforts to
realise this future, confusing consumers and wreaking havoc
on the new car market and the thousands of jobs it
supports”?
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My Lords, transport is now the biggest contributor to UK
greenhouse gases, and road transport makes up some 91% of
that, so it is important that we set a target for it, but I
agree with my noble friend that it is important that we work
alongside the automotive industry, which we are. As I said,
we want this transition to be industry and consumer-led, but
we must make sure that it is deliverable. We need to cut our
emissions to deliver improvements in air quality, but we must
do so in a way that allows our automotive industry to
continue to thrive.
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(CB)
My Lords, this is a multifaceted and complex problem. I hope
that the Government will take serious advice from not only
engineers but the medical profession—which has changed its
mind, creating a certain disorder in the decisions—and from
behavioural scientists. Will the Minister reassure us that
such detailed advice will be taken before we proceed in a
cavalier manner based on politics, in many instances?
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My Lords, I entirely agree that we must work across many
departments and get much advice on this. At the end of May,
we published our clean air strategy, which aims to cut all
forms of air pollution, not just transport emissions. It set
out a wide range of actions that the Government are taking.
We are working with the organisations the noble Lord
mentioned.
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(Lab)
My Lords, what discussions have taken place with, and what
assessment has been made of the likely impact on jobs in, the
car industry?
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The noble Lord is quite right to point to the number of jobs
in the UK car industry: there are nearly 190,000 direct jobs,
and we absolutely do need to protect them. We are working
very closely with the industry on this. As I said before, we
want to make sure that we set these targets and that they are
reached, but also that the transition is done in a managed
way, so that our very successful car industry can continue.
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(LD)
My Lords, the reality is that the 2040 date that the
Government announced is so far ahead as to have no impact on
the automotive industry, because individual manufacturers are
already announcing their own plans to produce only ultralow
emission vehicles. Does the Minister accept that, far from
leading, the Government are in fact lagging behind many other
countries, particularly within Europe? Do the Government
accept that they should reconsider their leisurely timescale
in order to have a positive impact on the health of our
nation, particularly our young children?
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My Lords, I am afraid that I do not agree that 2040 is
unambitious. As the noble Baroness points out, the industry
is setting its own targets, which is a great thing to see;
everyone is working together to deliver this. On the
international point, the UK was the first major economy in
the world to set out a challenging ambition to end the sale
of new conventional petrol and diesel vehicles by 2040. We
are also the second largest market in Europe for ultralow
emission vehicles, and for their development and manufacture.
One in eight electric cars sold in Europe was made in the UK,
and we are ranked sixth globally and second in Europe in that
regard, which is a position we should be proud of—but I
entirely agree that there is more that we can do.
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Lord (Lab)
My Lords, the Government’s silver bullet on this seems to be
the Road to Zero document. Could she tell us a bit more about
it? When did work on it start, and how did its existence
become known? I could find only one reference in government
documentation, which is to Defra owning it. Why has there
been no public consultation, when will it be published and
what questions will it answer?
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My Lords, we have been working hard on the Road to Zero
document and are in the final stages of pulling it together,
having welcomed the input of many stakeholders. It will be
published shortly. I wish that I could give noble Lords an
exact date, but I am afraid that I cannot at this point. We
are working closely with departments across government on
that issue. It forms part of all our efforts to reduce
emissions following the Clean Air Strategy consultation,
which was recently published. We set out our aim and
ambitions in the manifesto, and the two strategies taken
together—the Road to Zero strategy and the Clean Air
Strategy—will help to deliver those goals.
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(Con)
My Lords, I declare my interest, as I should, as the owner of
a mark 1, series 1 Land Rover from 1950 which, if it could,
would like to run on leaded fuel. What provisions will be
made for owners of historic vehicles and historic collections
of vehicles in carrying these regulations forward?
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My Lords, I know that historic vehicles can be incredibly
popular. It is possible to convert them to electric, as we
all saw at the recent royal wedding. However, it may be that
not all owners of historic vehicles can afford that
conversion, so we have said that the 2050 ambition is for
nearly all vehicles to be zero emission. There is in that a
recognition that certain types of vehicles may need special
consideration.
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